Theologian: Church must stand up for both genders

The theologian Gabriele Eder-Cakl heads the Austrian Pastoral Institute in Vienna. This is a specialist unit of the Austrian Bishops' Conference for pastoral work, catechesis and evangelisation. As the contact person for the synodal process in her home diocese of Linz, Eder-Cakl has been involved with the Synod on Synodality from the very beginning. At the beginning of October, the director of the Pastoral Institute took part in a meeting of lay people in Rome, whose demands were also included in an open letter to the Synod. She talks about this in an interview with katholisch.de and also about her hopes for the role of women in the Church.

Question: Ms Eder-Cakl, how do you experience the process of the Synod in Rome?

Eder-Cakl: I am happy to be part of this process of the Church because I have the feeling that something is really moving. Now people are sitting down together and openly discussing how to be Christian today. The Synod participants exchange pastoral experiences with each other and with the Pope. In this way, they take a close look at what the questions and signs of the times are. That is an enormously important process. Also listening to each other. I really believe that this alone changes something. The Church is so involved in different pastoral situations. Many things collide. And the good thing is that the Church can withstand it. I am happy about this synodal process. At the beginning of the Synod on Synodality, I was at a meeting of lay theologians from all over the world in Rome. There we discussed a lot about the challenges of the Church today. How the participation of all believers in the Church can be realised and how clericalism can be avoided were decisive questions. We then sent all our observations and demands to the Synod participants in an open letter. In it we demand more participation in the church in the form of co-responsibility, co-decision and mutual empowerment.

Question: What is your wish with regard to the role of women in the church?

Eder-Cakl: For years, I have been fully committed as a woman, as a leader, to gender justice at all levels of the Church and in society. I also bring this issue to the Austrian Bishops' Conference time and again. There is already a long tradition of dialogue between women, religious communities and church leaders. I think we are on the right path together. I also always consciously say: Gender justice is not a Central European phenomenon, but a worldwide issue. Gender equality is not a privilege or a special status, but a fundamental right for all. It is about the equality of women in society, in social policy, in education and also with regard to legal status. Above all, it is about the dignity of women. Also in access to the sacramental ministry.

Question: What are your concrete demands for women in the Church?

Eder-Cakl: It is quite simple: justice is shown in the fundamental access to all seven sacraments for all. This is not only demanded by a few feminists. I talk to women a lot and I always hear the same thing: it isimportant to the women that they have access to the three-tier ministry. So the diaconate for women is not just a zeitgeisty phenomenon, but a clear sign of the times that is and should be taken seriously. I assume that the Church wants to open up this office for us women. The topic of access for women to the diaconate can also be found in the Vatican's working paper of the World Synod "Instrumentum laboris" . The General Relator of the Synod, Cardinal Jean-Claude Hollerich, has also mentioned the diaconate of women as a theme of the World Synod. It is about valuing the charisms and participation of all in the Church. Because the hope is that it will be a real togetherness, in the spirit of the Synod, that is, real participation for all in the mission.

Question: Isn't it only cosmetic that one deals with this topic at the Synod and then again nothing will change? What do you hear about this from participants of the Bishops Synod?

Eder-Cakl: I don't think it is only cosmetic how the topic of women is discussed there at the Synod on Synodality. It may wear some people down that it is already taking so long with concrete decisions, for example, on access to office for women. I don't know exactly what is being discussed at the tables. But I assume that the topic is taken seriously - also on the basis of the official information, which is passed on by individual Synod participants in the media. The position and role of women in the Church is being discussed intensively at the World Synod.

Question: Do you think that by the end of the Synod concrete results for the diaconate of women will actually be on the table?

Eder-Cakl: Yes, I assume that in October 2024, towards the end of the second part of the Synod, there will be concrete decisions regarding women's access to the diaconate. There is no getting around that any more. The dioceses will probably also have something to reflect on in the phases in between. The women's issue in all its breadth is now central to the future of the entire universal Church.

Question: You were not invited to participate in the Synod in Rome. Did that offend you?

Eder-Cakl: Not every theologian can be there. In my thoughts and prayers, I will definitely be at the World Synod. I am glad that a pastoral theologian from Austria is also taking part. The theologian Klara-Antonia Csiszar is focusing on the Western and Eastern European context, she speaks several languages fluently and is very good theologically. I think it is wonderful that women are participating in the World Synod. It is a good start. But of course the picture of the participants in the World Synod could be even more colourful. Also in terms of age. Many of the participants are older. This could be changed, for example, by inviting younger participants. I am grateful that the Curia official and religious Sister Nathalie Becquart is here. For me, she is the supreme synod woman. I appreciate her very much because she really stands up for gender justice in the Vatican and in the Church. She and the Pope are moving forward step by step. This is also noticeable in Vatican committees, which are now increasingly made up of men and women, often with equal representation. Something is happening in Rome, I am confident.

Question: What is your goal, your vision for the Church of tomorrow?

Eder-Cakl: The participation of women in the Church must be taken seriously. I like to repeat it again: access to the seven sacraments for all. I no longer understand, and young people understand even less, why such a difference is still made between the sexes today. It is no longer justifiable It is often argued: Jesus can only be represented by a man. But then it would also have to say: Jesus only redeemed men. That would be the logic of this argument. But that is not true either. So you can't tie something like that to gender. I believe that the Church has the task of working in the world in the spirit of Jesus, for justice, for human dignity, for responsibility for creation. Therefore, in the spirit of Jesus, the Church must also stand up for both genders. I am glad that the Church is no longer shirking this task, but is seriously dealing with it and also talking about it, for example at the World Synod. I am glad and grateful for that. Honest gender justice would help us to live more credibly in this world as Christians tomorrow.